I got a package in the mail today! It was from the Catholic League! It included a personal, signed note from Bill Donohue! It also said "SWAK" and all the 'i's were dotted with hearts! (Oh, OK, I made up that last bit. A boy can dream, you know.)
It was their 2008 Report on Anti-Catholicism, a 74-page exercise in institutional paranoia, and I am featured on pages 26-30! Oh, joy! You know what that means: I can expect another uptick in sad letters from nuns and pious little old ladies in Waukegan.
One curious thing about those letters: they are all the same, and they all come in neatly lettered envelopes with printed return addresses in the top left corner, and they all come from Mrs. John Smith or Mrs. George Jones or some variant thereof. I don't know any of the names of these women, but I do know their husband's names. It's very, very weird — it's the formalism of patriarchy.
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Only 6% of the newsletter? For shame. You must try harder.
Well you know, there are several Mrs. George Joneses out there, and one them was Tammy Wynette! I 'spect she was Baptist, though.
Didn't Donohue at least sign his note with a "God Bless," or at least a "Respectfully Yours?"
In Christ,
Mrs. Mr. Sastra
I assume you'll be reprinting it for us?
Come now, PZ. Knowing what we do about the protest-too-much crowd, you can't rule out transvestitism.
Well when I get hate mail responding to my Letters to the Editor here in Charleston, they are always on postcards with no return address and no names. Usually scribbled all over the sides and edges and top.
Shame on you PZ. Ol' Bill is jest trin ta be frendly.
A personalized, signed note from Bill Donohue!
Don't keep us in the dark. What did it say?
Did he tell you that he would pray for you?
No, he had no special endearment in the signoff--just "Bill". It's nice to know we're on a first-name basis, but I had hoped and dreamed for so much more.
So what you're saying is that these nice old doddering ladies haven't quite gotten around to understand the proper form of spam mail?
I had no idea this was such a twisted love/hate relationship. This makes me feel icky.
Silly question: what did pages 26-30 say? Could you post it?
I had hoped and dreamed for so much more.
Maybe if you had some meth...
The Catholic League is selling the 2008 Report on Anti-Catholicism for $10 on their website.
Why would anyone pay money for this?
It's 5 pages. I don't want to have to retype all that. Mainly what it is is a chronology, and copies of meanie-pants mail they received. It actually isn't very interesting.
Methinks after Donkeyhues recent spat with Comfort he is either looking for 'fwendship cos he is a vewy un'appy little xian' or he looking to set up a good 'kicking de kat'...or in this case PZ!
OT but for some good LULZ.
CPAC Teabagging in DC
You just can't make this stuff up. GOP is going to provide decades of comedy if they keep this up.
You aren't mentioned until Page 26? Does this mean there's someone else out there vying for our affections who gets mentioned first?
Masturbation material for Catholics?
Humbug! Some of us doddering old ladies were taught the correct manner of addressing an envelope in proper schools for young ladies. It has nothing to do with being a christian, you whippersnappers. *SNORT*
Damn they charge $10 bucks for it on their site.
Maybe you could scan it to pdf?
Bah never mind. You're right. It probably is boring.
Uhmmffff. You get all the perks...
PZ, Respond to him that it isn't personal Anti-Catholicism, its general incredulity of the stupidity of all religions.
You (and the rest of us critical thinking beings) are an equal opportunity debunker.
"but I had hoped and dreamed for so much more."
We need some slash fiction here! I'd say PZ makes a good top and Bill the bottom.
..only 5 pages - just scan it in. Anyway I would have thought you would get more seeing as you crucified Christ again this year.
I just Googled "2008 Report on Anti-Catholicism". It appears they actually charge money for it, as opposed to pushing its distribution as far as possible. You should publish the relevant section here, especially if there is anything libelous in it.
Please tell me they actually called you a meanie-pants. The Catholic Church should totally adopt that as its official descriptive of high-ranking sinners. Satan, abortionists and PZ Myers - meanie-pantses, one and all.
Ugh.. sorry but another OT. I think you'll love this one PZ. Things seem to be getting very interesting there in Minnesota.
Secret Coleman-Lawyer E-Mails Reveal Intentional Hiding Of Witness -- Franken Camp Wants Double-Count Claim Thrown Out Completely
"PZ, Respond to him that it isn't personal Anti-Catholicism, its general incredulity of the stupidity of all religions..."
Donohue would just say that obviously he thinks all other religions not his own are half-baked DOAs. Donohue won't accept it because whether it's about one or all, the effect is perceived as against him and his group.
This is a precious "gesture" though. PZ continues to make a name for himself. PZ perhaps you should take a picture of this "anti-catholicism report" in the garbage can next to the cracker you skewered. Please tell me you didn't take that particular bag out to the curb...
Wow, you know how much a Bill Donohue signature is worth?
Probably as much as Ray Comfort's!
Glen D
http://tinyurl.com/6mb592
@#19
According to the "Who is buying all that porn?" they have enough porn.
Are there no unmarried women among them? Do they always marry them off so young that they haven't learned to write or can't afford postage until after they have acquired (or been assigned) a husband?
Skyhood @ 14 says: "The Catholic League is selling the 2008 Report on Anti-Catholicism for $10 on their website.
Why would anyone pay money for this?"
My mother, as a good Catholic, would. She can't have her faith denigrated. She probably gets the report free, though, because she donates to Bill's fantasy world of paranoia. I'll have to pay her a visit to read pages 26-30.
One piece of good news, though: The Vatican has decided...
I'm not defending the Catholic church, by the way. We'd all be better off without them. But at least they're sticking to the correct side in this dispute.
Article Here.
I always get a little thrill when I hear stories of a blossoming new love.
Did they spell my name right?
Hey, where's our report on anti-atheism? Don't we have a committee or something working on that? Blog posts aren't enough, and they've already got 74 pages. We must not allow a report gap!
I hope you have a scanner so you can post the funniest of the letters you receive. They shouldn't be left out just because they don't use e-mail.
WELL, when you get thet email from jesus, we might have something to crow about.
From Catholic League Website:
PZ has reached "War on Christmas" status!
Pay attention, PZ, you were included because of your stunt desecrating the Holy Host. Next year you will be forgotten probably.
Good point, the same reason people pay $100 for a totebag from NPR. It's really a donation to charity.
My favorite fringe pundit (Brent Bozell) weighs in on the catholic-bashing. He is completely humorless, which makes his rants all the funnier.
OTP, but here is his review of Expelled
A sample: "Myers and Dawkins now both complain they were "duped" into appearing in the movie..."
AVSN @ #41
Not if he thinks up something even more eeeeeeevil and diabolical to do this year.
It could be a yearly tradition like Christmas! Only, y'know, without the fetishizing of poor people having babies in filth.
We sure hope so.
Even the ones from the nuns? Do those all say, "Mrs. Jesus Christ"?
It's very, very weird — it's the formalism of patriarchy.
It is indeed, and the people who subscribe to it seem to think that everyone should. My sister-in-law always writes to my sister and addresses the envelope Mrs. Husbandfirst Husbandlast, even though neither of those names are part of my sister's name. It's pretty insulting actually. If she does that to me when I get married I will send the letters back marked "no such person".
Also, congratulations on being immortalized in such an important document!
Our PZ has hit the big time. No more slumming around with Eurotrash like Dawkins in shopping mall theaters. Bill is now on a first name basis with PZ.
I hate that name convention BS. We're not doing anything to my name after our wedding, the only thing I could see is that it would take more work on my part to change it, so why bother? :)
It's nice they featured you, there's no such thing as bad publicity! lol.
If 7% of all noteworthy anti-Catholicism in the world for all of 2008 was caused by PZ tossing a cracker in the trash, then the RCC gets less hate than I do from my renters in Second Life.
It was pretty nice of him to send you a copy.
It's completely opposite of the treatment you received from the expelled crew, even though it was probably meant as some sort of 'dig'.
Hey, four pages isn't bad. At least it's some press right?
I wish I had a copy, and wish I could be included. I call Catholics and the hyper religious wingnuts, batshit crazy, etc. all the time.
So did they bother to include any conservative, Protestant anti-Catholicism at all in their little book? Or is my theory that they only care about kicking the godless, teh Gheys and feminist, liberal communists correct?
Whoever these wives are, signing their names as the name of their husbands make me pity them. They have no identity left. They are tools and toys.
Of course, anti-Catholicism came about as a reaction against all the persecution of and animosity towards protestants by the Catholics.
But what, do they have fervent protestants in that book? It would be more logical to include the more genuine types of anti-Catholicism, which is by protestants. To include just rationalist irreligious people is just silly.
PZ wrote:
I have little doubt there's a few hundred pharyngulites that would happily scan and PDF your docs for you. Of course, that starts to tread on cult leader territory. Hm.
Well, I'll scan 'em.
PZ - Is the comedy series Mr. Deity in this book? http://mrdeity.com/
Next year, for the "War on Christmas," PZ is going to stick a Christmas tree up a little plastic angel's behind. That should be worth at least a page.
Given the spike in batshit insane wingnuttery lately, I hope you had it tested for anthrax...
Just sayin'.
Who got the centerfold?
They probably ran out of nasty names to call him.
I wonder if they consider those who insist pedophile priests be prosecuted, not just shipped off to some backwater parish, to be anti-catholic. Maybe they're saving that for volume II.
Maybe their efforts would best be turned toward stopping Christian hatred of "the other":
I first saw this story at FireDogLake but the link there led to a story that somehow omitted the Jesus reference.
This is tragic and I don't mean to make light of this event for political gain. However, there is a increasingly hostile contingent in this nation that have wrapped themselves in Christian virtue and are taking their self-righteous anger to the streets to kill. Methinks Jesus would be appalled at the misplaced indignation.
How about a Catholic letter writing campaign against Hannity, Glen Beck, Limbaugh, Coulter and the rest of the professional class of hate and anger instigators.
Sorry, that should have been CrooksandLiars and not FireDogLake.
D'ya think that Blowhard Bill could give up whining for Lent?
We have an old fundy Christian friend whose return address stickers read: Mrs. Hisfirstname Hislastname. Usually this would be merely stick-in-the-mud conventional, but in this case it's a bit macabre: her husband died of cancer in 1992. And she's certainly no meek retiring stereotype of Christian womanhood, either: she's smart, well educated, took charge her situation and raised three children on her own, who turned out pretty well. Really, they're a wonderful family except for this bizarre hobby that they take way too seriously....
Will the Catholic Church be getting a package from the Jewish Anti-Defamation League soon? Maybe there's a 5 page article on Bishop Williamson.
#44,
Hey, I know what PZ could do, he print the really choice Bible versus on toilet paper and err,... well you know, and the post a picture of it to see if we find an image of the Virgin Mary or Jebus in the err,... well you know,... the wipings.
Well, considering that the big rollout of the Major Report on Anti-Catholic Poopyheads™ was Fat Tuesday, they could have.
But if that's the case, they already broke their Lenten pledge...
Nah, the ADL is too busy slapping scarlet As (for anti-Semite) on anyone who so much as criticizes Israeli traffic laws.
Matt Heath, #53: So did they bother to include any conservative, Protestant anti-Catholicism at all in their little book?
This is a point I was wondering about. It's interesting that Donohue is so obsessed concerned about "put-a-nail-through-a-wafer" PZ Myers, when the people who were really responsible for the segregation, imprisonment, and killing kind of persecution of Catholics are the ancestors of those nice Protestant folks next to them on the anti-abortion picket lines.
Shouldn't we give ol' Bill at least some credit for being up front with his propaganda? He sent that package as a gift, with a friendly note.
PZ should send him a thank you card. (Which might have the side effect of causing ol' Bill to have a heart attack, and then he can see sweet baby jezus even sooner than he'd planned.)
(sorry I don't know how to quote stuff)
PZ: It's 5 pages. I don't want to have to retype all that. Mainly what it is is a chronology, and copies of meanie-pants mail they received. It actually isn't very interesting.
That's what TA's are for.
Er, one problem. UMM is an undergraduate college (at least in biology). No TA's. That is why PZ gets grumpy around finals.
Well when I get hate mail responding to my Letters to the Editor here in Charleston, they are always on postcards with no return address and no names. Usually scribbled all over the sides and edges and top.
What? They're not engraved and hand-delivered by the house Negro on a small silver platter? (it's been in the family since before the War of Northern Aggression)
Hmm, atheist writer of letters to the P&C - that certainly narroww down your identity.
In Dorothy Sayers' Lord Peter Wimsey books, Harriet's title after she marries Lord Peter is... Lady Peter.
An Oxford grad, who supported herself as a writer until her mid-thirties, and there she is with no trace of herself left in her own name.
I find the whole name-changing thing deeply weird. My own sister changed her last name when she married; and she's the high-powered lawyer while he's the stay-at-home dad, so it wasn't an intimidation thing... in fact, I have no idea why she decided to do that.
No, it's not. It's Lady Wimsey.
Prof. Myers--------from now on you need to just stamp those bullshit things from religious groups as "Return to Sender" or "Not at This Address" and put them back in the mail.
I'm surprised that so many people are surprised that the catholics would charge money for their bilious screed. They aren't the wealthiest religion because they're charitable. Come on all you former catholics, you should know better.
Or stamp the stuff "Recipient raptured -- Return to sender". That ought to cause a kerfuffle.
PZ, As an ex-Catholic, I'm jealous that you made the book. Everybody knows no one is more anti-Catholic than people--like me--who have escaped from their evil clutches!
They didn't give you a 2-page glossy photo spread? I'd be pissed, man. Pick someone else at random and complain they got a much more interesting article than yours, etc.
Or have someone pretend to be your agent and make a crank call like that.
PZ and all you Pharyngulites, I vote we do the following: Let's all send Mr. Donahue a nice little gift through the mail also (as they're unreachable by e-mail). Specifically, I think we should videotape ourselves desecrating a cracker (or host if you like), burn it to DVD, and send it to Bill Donahue. Bet he can't complain to YouTube and have those mailed DVDs age gated like he did to FSMdude.
Only $10????????
It's a steal!!
Look what you get for it!!!
"...the controversy surrounding Pastor John Hagee’s endorsement of Senator John McCain; and extensive coverage of the War on Christmas."
"In addition to the findings, William Donohue provides an executive summary, which places the incidents in perspective."
http://www.catholicleague.org/release.php?id=1562
This is cutting edge stuff!
What's global warming, world poverty or the economic crisis compared to this?????
Don't cheap atheists, fork out!!!!!!
Strange - a Tricky song popped into my head as I read this post...
And now it's stuck there. Oh well, it's a pretty good track.
Darn. #62 stole my comment.
In other earth shattering events... James Dobson announced he's stepping down from Focus on the Family today.
Now ol' Bill should move in and grab that flock!
My father taught me, from an early age, to send back any letters addressed to a Mrs Husbandname and to write "no such person at this address" on the envelope. I have maintained this habit but find its actually quite rare these days.
On a related note Mr Shrek, bless his feminist heart, insisted we hyphenate our surnames jointly when we got married. This created no end of problem for the old biddies down at the driver's licence bureau who could cope with ME hyphenating my name but went into apoplexy at the notion of my husband doing it. We were told I could change my name with my marriage cert but he needed to have a Deed Poll issued by the court.
At that point I went into bitch-lawyer mode so we got our way, the biddies were chastened and order returned to the universe.
Did Donohue mention that meanie Jack Chick, and his evangelical buddies?
Ahem...
'Tis Himself,
Actually Lady Peter is indeed the correct form. Since lord Peter is the 2nd son, lady Wimsey is her mother or her sister-in-law, the wife of the actual lord Wimsey, his eldest brother. At least that's what Dorothy Sayers wrote, and I tend to belive her. (In Bushman's Honeymoon it was remarked how an educated person used the correct form of address as opposed some other characters.)
Such a gift deserves a thank you note in return, preferably written directly on a communion wafer.
to PZ @ #19
That's your first entry at the 2009 edition, right there. :p
And of course, it would be up to the recipient to figure out whether it was the flesh of a long-dead Jew or not.
The problem is that her husband's title is Lord Peter Wimsey, not Lord Peter. So Lady Wimsey is correct. I happen to know the wife of a younger son of a British noble and she is Lady Lastname, not Lady Firstname.
BTW, Lord Peter Wimsey's father and elder brother were Dukes of Denver, so they aren't (weren't) Lord Wimsey. Also, if you want to be completely correct, Wimsey (which is how many people in the books refer to him) is Lord Peter Death Breedon Wimsey, DSO.
Without wanting to sound snobbish in any way I'll just mention that I have the title of Lady and it's because my dad is a Laird. Mum is Lady firstname of placename, my sisters and I are Lady firstname surname. Really the UK nobility is so inbred no one can really get a grip of the various titles etc. One of my cousins had about 12 titles and that's not uncommon. Don't even get me started on the Eurpoean houses- even more convoluted.
Actually that's even more complicated as the title which we hold isn't from the Lairdship in Scotland but from dad's baronacy in England. We don't use the bloody thing anyhow but I'm still majorly pissed that DeBrett's doesn't have my OM in my entry.
Soooo, that means we should refer to you as LADY Queen of Sluts?
Dammit, what color of gloves do I need for that. *grin*
I remember the story of a Catholic priest in Iraq who was kidnapped and murdered last year.
In that context, it's interesting that the "Catholic League" would choose to highlight PZ's exercise of free speech as an example of Anti-Catholicism.
I really want a "PZ Myers is God" T-shirt so I can wear it on Sunday. That would get Bill's goat.
C.
Did the book mention this site, or just the incident? If they did, we might need to get ready for an upswing in trolls. Still, a few of them make for pretty good Molly auditions, so it should be workable.
My my --you worry about our return addresses. Some widows keep their husband's name on such labels and in phone books as a protection against those looking for women alone to rob or whatever.
Others of us have been Mrs. So and So for so long, it IS our name --it was strange to lose the maiden name, but not regretted. Some of us like "belonging" to our man --and he, to us. We leave our family to start a new one with him as the head of it. And we don't mind taking his name instead of he, ours. Our parents and grandparents did it that way --it makes geneological sense to reduce a couple to one name. I use my maiden name as a middle name for writing --just because I had a life as a young woman and would want those who knew me back then to recognize me.
How uncivil of you, Prof, to refer to Donohue as a kook, just because he (and others) are trying to present their perspective to you.
I inherited the title "Mister" from my father. In England, the title "Mrs" passes exclusively through the female line.
I trust this clears the matter up.
Huh. I guess that answers my question.
Fuck off Barb.
Barb, not only is Donohue a kook, you are one too. You have presented absolutely no evidence for your god existing or you bible being true. You need some credibility, and that is where is starts. Time to put up or shut up.
Barb, or may I call you "Mrs" Barb? I do hope you are not going to use this thread to talk about anal sex this time.
I found your last postings quite upsetting.
Anal sex makes Baby Jesus cry.
Dohonue has been shown to be a kook by a lot more than simply sending a book to PZ. If you are going to be reductionist, try not to neglect certain factors, lest you sound like an uneducated ignoramus.
Patricia,
I prefer to maintain a more casual serfdom so you may continue to refer to me as Bride/Slut/whatever without fear of a beheading.
I do however expect a genuflect should we ever meet in person.
Oh go on, then, talk diry to us.
What are you wearing?
Alas, I could only offer a shamufect.
Barb @ #103:
Besides, the last name isn't at issue. What's odd is that these women are signing their husbands' GIVEN names, not just their shared family names. For instance, if we were to ever marry (the odds of which are slightly less than those of a pig flying from Hell with a snowball in its mouth), you would presumably become Mrs. Barb(ara?) Geiger, not Mrs. Benjamin Geiger. I say "presumably" because I'm not going to insist that my wife (if someone ever becomes crazy enough to marry me) change her name.
Barb had been around about a week before, actually. She'd been in the can-Ward-Denker-see-sexism-in-front-of-his-nose thread with the poll about female politicians (plus Michelle Obama) running daycares, and single-handedly turned it into yet another abortion thread. She may have popped up in other threads, but I've been away for a few days. So, not directly from Donahue's free advertising.
No, no, anal sex makes barb cry too. It's about oral-genital contact that Barb is keeping mum.
As for her title, it is Mrs. Creationist Hubby-Scientist-Doctor. (Double hyphen must mean she's a blue blood)
Barb has been regaling us with the fascinating news that her M.D. husband (D.O.?) is a scientist because he is a doctor, and that hubby is a creationist, oh, and Barb finds gays and buttseks repugnant and we're all wrong about evolution and we're all going to hell.
Did I forget anything Barb?
I've got a good idea. All PZ needs are 2 bits of wood, some prickly shrubbery, a few nails, and a recently deceased chimpanzee.
Mewonders how much a wackaloon's autographed note will fetch on ebay...
"Whoever these wives are, signing their names as the name of their husbands make me pity them. They have no identity left. They are tools and toys."
One of the tough decisions I've had to make, even before becoming an atheist--was to either refuse to open letters to me from family that insist on addressing them to me as "Mrs. William Smith", or to just ignore it for the sake of keeping the peace. I've wimped out on this one. (Telling people that I didn't like to be addressed this way because it completely subsumes my identity has had no effect whatever.)
Also, Taz @46, as all of us recovering catholics know, nuns do, in fact, consider themselves married to jebus. Some I knew even wore wedding bands to advertise this strange concept.
I once read somewhere about a woman talking about her name. She said that as a woman you are given your father's name, then you marry and take your husbands. As a woman your name is not your own, but is the name of the man who has claim to you.
(I'm paraphrasing... I don't remember enough of the text to get anything meaningful out of a search.)
If they're married to Jesus, why don't they sign their letters "Mrs. Jesus Christ?"
That Jesus, what a polygamist.
And how incredibly moronic of you to make such a ridiculous comment.
Donohue is a kook. I would say it would be hard for me to think of someone more of a kook that Donohue.... but we have such other great kooks to choose from.
Ray Comfort.
Ken Ham
Kent Hovind
The Pope.
My Senator Jim DeMint
you
Jerry Falwell
The Time Cube guy
I could go on.
but I won't.
Rev., here's one worthy of the top ten:
John Hutchison
Rev BDC:
*clenched-tentacle salute*
they all come from Mrs. John Smith or Mrs. George Jones or some variant thereof. I don't know any of the names of these women, but I do know their husband's names. It's very, very weird
Funny you mention this.
After several years of working customer service for the USPS, today was the very first time a female customer signed for something as Mrs. Robert Whosit. Ever. And the really weird thing is that she was in her early 40s! I could understand it from someone of my mother's generation, but even they don't do that anymore! I've had crotchety old broads of 90 come in and sign with their first name. Mabel Doohickey or Clara Whatshername. I've also worked in several of the stations that cater to the "upper class" (customers who have drivers--kid you not), and even those women signed their own names.
My immediate reaction was pity. I figured she was either a doormat, or a seriously deluded fundie. Or both.
And the second feeling was the creeps. Ew. It's like wearing your husband's worn-out underwear. Ew!
Has anyone noticed that this report weighs 12 pounds!
This is from the CL website where the report costs $10.00 (like they need the money).
"Catholic League's 2008 Report on Anti-Catholicism
Details
SKU SKU16221
Weight 12.00 lbs
Price: $10.00 (€ 8.70)"
I would have never imagined that hot air could weigh so much!
C.
Prof. Myers--------from now on you need to just stamp those bullshit things from religious groups as "Return to Sender" or "Not at This Address" and put them back in the mail.
Er, no. The proper (and coincidentally rudest) endorsement would be Refused. And depending on how it's sent, it may never get back to the sender, anyway.
Besides, what fun to get something like this!
Gah. I can't believe you have to buy the reports! You'd think they'd want people to know the icky details! Speaking of details, would you summarize your entry?
Joe
It's good to see the Catholic Church is making their people aware of all the anti-Christian bigotry that goes on in the world today.
On a side note I wonder if they included a link to this blog so people will start commenting on Crackergate.
A suggestion for you women wondering what to do if receiving a letter addressed to Mrs. HusbandFirst HusbandLast: give it to your husband to read and (perhaps) respond; after all it is clearly intended for him, right?
Also, I'd like to bring up one name-change-by-marriage I find quite inspiring.
As told by Penn Jillette (self-described liar):
When Sigrid Fry and Bob Corn got married, they decided that "Fry-Corn" and "Corn-Fry" were both unacceptable as surnames and so they created a new component for their hyphenates. They are now named Sigrid Fry-Revere and Bob Corn-Revere respectively, passing only the new component on to offspring.
Does this mean that the virgin Mary is properly referred to as Mrs. God?
START commenting? Read the archives. There are probably over half a dozen threads with 1000+ comments dealing with the subject. Go read them ALL and then we'll discuss it.
I think you are anti-Waukegan, PZ.
HJ
If I may join the fixing fray...
Fixed, I say.
Facilis, if you are so offended by Crackergate, go the fuck away. It will make life easier for you.
Also, I doubt that there could be anything new said on that topic.
Barb, Bill Donahue has a long and loud history of being a gas bag kook.
MSNBC
PZ, why not scan it? No need for re-typing!
I wonder though - the report, did it suddenly and periodically ALL REVERT INTO CAPITALIZATION for no ApPARent Reason?
"I don't know any of the names of these women, but I do know their husband's names. It's very, very weird — it's the formalism of patriarchy."
Er, it is weird that you know more about their sex life than about their identity :-)
Maybe you should write to their _husbands_, pointing out how inappropriate it is that they allow their wives contacting strange men.
EV #115:
'Blue-bloodedness' is something Barb may well aspire too, seeing as it represents a peculiarly Christian type of racism.
Of course, only cephalopods (and other molluscs) are genuinely blue-blooded.
My wife took my (real) surname, but it was entirely her choice: I'd have supported whatever she did.
As it happens, the surname she sported when I met her was her third - she changed it by deed poll two weeks into midwifery training, because neither her maiden name (Butcher) nor her first married name (Beaver) were considered entirely suitable, and a hyphenated one was too horrendous to think about.
But because she took on the surname of one of her Greek ancestors, I think she got bored with teaching people how to spell and pronounce it every single time, so she was only too happy to take on mine. Not least because she got her old initials back.
At last some useful info. Thanks to Bill Donahue (that little angel) i know that Mel Gibson is a catholic. Otherwise he's perfect though. Doesn't scare me off.
I knew a man named Pickelheimer who married a woman named Cunningham. He changed his name to hers.
Thanks to Bill Donahue (that little angel) i know that Mel Gibson is a catholic.
Umm... Gibson hasn't exactly been keeping this a secret!
Otherwise he's perfect though. Doesn't scare me off.
He's also a misogynist anti-Semite, which might put some people off...
And in an unrelated but curiously coincidental event, James Dobsonfly has relinquished his helm with focus on the hellgrammite to pursue his lifelong dream in getting a menage a trois with Marilyn Musgrave and Ted Haggarty.
143: "He's also a misogynist anti-Semite"
small details, details... think he's just drinking and being foolish. Bad childhood, heard of alcohol and drugs? There's a lot of that stuff around. Probably same in Hollywood.
Don't know him personally yet... wouldn't trust the "misogynist" diagnose without a thorough investigation. Anti-semite? well...
Mel Gibson's anti-Semitic remarks cited in official police report
Thanks for filling out my blank spaces anyway, Svetogorsk. Been to busy with my astronomy books lately.
Yes, they tend to turn down your internal censor, allowing you to say things you'd normally hide.
The Talmud says that a man is known in three ways. What he says when he is drunk, what he says when he is angry, and what he spends his money on. On all three counts, it appears that Mel Gibson has sadly shown his true colors. Upon getting arrested for drunk driving, in his inebriated state, he allegedly said something to the effect that "fucking Jews are responsible for all the world’s wars." In his anger he asked the arresting deputy if he himself was Jewish. And, of course, he spent $25 million dollars of his own money arguing that the Jews killed Jesus. Well, there you have it. Drink, anger, and money all lead Mel Gibson to acts of anti-Semitism.
James Dobson announced he's stepping down from Focus on the Family today. - Patricia, OM
To spend more time with his family?
(Note: in the UK, this is the traditional formulation when a politician is forced to resign due to scandal or gross incompetence - not sure if this is just a quaint British custom or not!)
Knockgoats, it is also used on this side the Atlantic.
On the subject of conjugal nomenclature...
This will doubtlessly amuse Her Ladyship, Bride of Shrek, OM, but Mrs. MP kept her maiden name at my urging. She was willing to go traditional, but I have my reasons.
First, her name is much easier to spell and pronounce than mine.
Second, she's kind of sort of maybe an heraldic heiress (which, with three bucks, gets her a cup of coffee from a latte stand), and I'm a sucker for that sort of thing.
Third, I came within an inch or so of taking her family name due to a dispute with my own kin.
She also offered to hyphenate our names, which would have been a bit awkward...and in the long run, this is what we have done for our adopted PandaCub (who will no doubt thank us profusely as only an annoyed teenager can).
(I admit to taking a perverse pleasure in receiving any item of junk mail addressed to Mr. Myname Hername...and invariably consign these to the recycle bin.)
The MadPanda, FCD
Nerd, thanks.
On the married-name business, one very elderly member of my wife's family does send Christmas cards addressed to Mr. and Mrs. Knock Goats (well, almost). Another, of our own age group, hyphenates our names (which we've never done) - and bizarrely, gets mine wrong. I do sometimes admit to being Mr. Hername on the 'phone, and she to being Mrs. Goats, although sometimes these misnamings are a useful clue that it's a cold call (so my response to "Can I speak to Mr. Hername?" is to say "I'll see if he's in", lay the phone down, and go away for five minutes, by which time they'll invariably have given up).
The only reason the Redhead took my last name is that she kept the same initials. That way, it would not effect her artwork.
The Virgin Mary is a child of God--God is the Father of us all. Only a real sicko would imply that she was married to God in any way, whether by taking his name or bearing his child. Oh, wait, that did happen. Sorry.
Some folks that I knew got married, some years ago. They both had strange-ish last names. I proposed that they build a new name by combining parts of their last names--my version came out Dobuki, as I recall. They didn't do it, but the couple-nicknames like Brangelina that are now popular are the same thing.
Hrm... as an Atheistic, PZ fan with an extra ten bucks, the ability to type some 98 words per minute, a personal collection of odd religious literature, and a custom printing service I may find myself compelled to order the book, type up the referenced pages, post them for everyone and then finish off the exercise by printing up a few shirts that say "Fuck Jesus, PZ Myers can save me."
I needed something to do next weekend anyway.
Six percent of the entire publication was devoted to cracker abuse, eh? So, how does that compare to the coverage of the infamous "1priest1nun" (a.k.a. "church of fudge") video? I'm curious how they decided the correct amount of apoplexy to assign to a particular issue, and I think answering this question would go a long way to udnerstanding how their minds work.
The protestants should make a list too.What do you think are the top anti-protestant acts of bigotry this year?
http://www.nationalreview.com/kurtz/kurtz200504280758.asp
Facilis, given your track record for dishonesty, it doesn't matter. Try showing real proof and real argument for your inane assertions. Until then, you have nothing.
#131: Thanks for coming to the defense of Waukegan. I lived there for 25 years. I never found anything offensive about it.
Mel Gibson is not the same kind of Catholic Bill Donohue is. Mel's little offshoot doesn't recognize the Pope and uses Latin in their Masses.
Waukegan, it's part of the Chiwaukee metroplex I live in. The city is older than Chicago, and the most famous people from it are Jack Benny and Ray Bradbury. And it is an immigrant city. Pre WWII, it was mostly central European and Catholic. These days, Latin America. PZ is probably getting letters from the Catholic widows.
When my younger son was in fourth grade he decided he wanted to learn how to play the violin. Since we lived in Waukegan it seemed only fitting that the lessons were given at the Jack Benny Middle School.
Jerry Orbach went to high school in Waukegan.
That's nothing. John Kwok went to high school with every famous person you've ever heard of.
You can't say PZ is God = PZ is an atheist, you can't say he doesn't believe in himself. (He might be Neptune, tho)
Isn't molesting a young little Catholic boy an anti-Catholic activity?
Let him tell you about the joke he played on Neil Degrasse Tyson. Kwok and Stephen hawking are BFFs you know, because Steve used to babysit John before he had to use the wheelchair - which reminds John of a funny story about the time when he and Louis Leakey got into a towel fight and John stung Louis on the ass with a brilliant wet-tipped whipcrack from his gym towel, he was only 3 or 4 but ...
Catholics don't masturbate. Only the priest is supposed to touch you there.
I would think Dobson is stepping down because he is old. Do you know differently?
Probably
Doesn't make him less of a lying, obfuscating, facts denying asshole.
Barb, we like to think he is stepping down because he realized he is a fraud and a failure. Just like you.
Considering that Dobson's swarm, Focus on the Family, has been losing money the past couple of years, it's probably a good idea that Jimmy step down and let some other fucktard run the cabal.
I would think Dobson is stepping down because he is old. Do you know differently?
YOU quote Donohue as saying all of the following: QUOTE:
________________________
"Who really cares what Hollywood thinks? All these hacks come out there. Hollywood is controlled by secular Jews who hate Christianity in general and Catholicism in particular. It‘s not a secret, OK? And I‘m not afraid to say it. That‘s why they hate this movie. It‘s about Jesus Christ, and it‘s about truth. It‘s about the messiah.
Hollywood likes anal sex. They like to see the public square without nativity scenes. I like families. I like children. They like abortions. I believe in traditional values and restraint. They believe in libertinism. We have nothing in common. But you know what? The culture war has been ongoing for a long time. Their side has lost.
You have got secular Jews. You have got embittered ex-Catholics, including a lot of ex-Catholic priests who hate the Catholic Church, wacko Protestants in the same group, and these people are in the margins. Frankly, Michael Moore represents a cult movie. Mel Gibson represents the mainstream of America."
__________________________
I'm sure you would disagree that Michael moore represents a cult movie [is this a misprint? should it be "cult movement?"] and that Mel Gibson represents the mainstream of America --and you would probably not say it is "wacko" protestants who agree with the angry ex-catholics, though I know what he means here --he is referring to protestants who have a history of hating Catholicism--and they do exist) and you would disagree that your side has lost the culture war. So would I --up to a point. And you would disagree that the movie he was defending (the Passion of the Christ?) was about Truth and about the real Messiah. But which of the OTHER above statements do you all (being monolithic) disagree with???
Are there not people in Hollywood who hate Christianity the way bloggers here do? ARe there not secular Jews in Hollywood who are atheists or at least liberals and hate devout Catholics? Do these liberals not have strong influence in Hollywood, even if they do not control it exactly? Does't Hollywood celebrate and condone sodomy?
Just what statement, other than those I conceded, do you disagree with as made by Donohue?
Barb, Yawn, quantity does not equal quality, especially given your low quality.
I think that Barb is either drunk or high.
not just hollywood
"They" like to see the constitution supported
Tell me how those are contrary positions to hold.
Libertinsim?
Do you also believe in traditional value of women subservience and racial separation?
Really?
What just happened in the last election?
Oh really, so who won the Oscar for Best Anal this year?
That reminds me... "Who the fuck does Ang Lee think he is, man? I mean you make a supposedly "pro-gay" movie and you don't show one guy getting a hummer the whole movie. What am I, fucking six years old? I can't see a guy getting sucked off by another guy? I'm not a fucking kid, I can take it Ang. I'm a realist, man, I like to see real shit going down."
Barb, why do you care what other consenting adults do in the privacy of their own home?
Just to put BillDo's report into perspective, here's a video comparing gay-bashing and christian-bashing.
My parents are devout Catholics, and I am an atheist (left religion behind at 26, just in time for Advent). Guess which one of us is the most regular reader of the local diocese newspaper -- reading the words of the representatives of the Church itself (especially the odious crap they pumped out during the election, just barely avoiding actual candidate endorsements on the odd technicality) is all the anti-Catholic propaganda I need.
Anyway, I find the idea of charging for religious propaganda to be hilarious beyond belief -- after all, if you're supposed to be evangelizing, don't you want as many people as possible to see your work? Consider Focus on the Sexually Repressed Christian Fundamentalist Family, or even better consider notorious WikiRoach Jason Gastrich -- he decided to write a rebuttal for the Skeptic's Annotated Bible, and unlike the free resource he was attempting to "correct" and "explain", he distributes his drivel only on CD-ROM. Just how important is his message anyway?
Strictly speaking, Tricky's version of a Public Enemy song popped into your head.
I'm sorry sorry sorry to everyone for encouraging her and I know this is completely OT but I can't restrain myself any longer.
Barb - these are for you to answer:
1) I am a heterosexual woman who happens to like anal sex on occasion. Is this still wrong in your eyes?
2) Does the bible actually say anything about lesbian relationships?
>> Does this mean that the virgin Mary is properly referred to as Mrs. God?
> The Virgin Mary is a child of God--God is the Father of us all.
Ohmygod, Mr God had a child with Miss God.
No wonder catholic priests prefer kids...
#50 Naked Bunny w/a Whip (oooo!) cuts to the chase as always.
Can't be that much anti-papism out there.
But, still, it's something to aspire to to get in the index.
When I get phone calls asking for "Mr. Lastname" I sometimes say "Sorry, my father's been dead for more than 30 years" and hang up. I need to come up with something eqivalent for the idiots that ask for "Mr. or Mrs. Lastname." I usually just correct them to "Miss," but some of them absolutely refuse to accept my correction.
Ok, so you give up your name to belong to him. If he also belongs to you, then why doesn't he do the same thing and give up his name? He should become Mr. Barb Soandso.
Personally,I don't see any reason to change my name when I get married, or for my kids to have my husband's name. I made a deal with my boyfriend that we both agreed is very fair. Our kids can take his last name as soon as he squeezes them through a small hole in his body. If he doesn't like having a different name than his children, he's free to take my last name. I don't know what we'd do if we adopted kids, though.
He's the head of the house and I was glad to give up my maiden name for a married name --my husband's. Though it was odd at first to acquire a new name. Marriage involves a lot of changes --all good. What a man! Sharing a last name shows that we are a family unit, father, mother, kids. People who want to defy convention just make life confusing for schools, all record keepers, and for their children and people they meet, as well.
Aww, Barb. Who gives a shit what you think? We don't! Piss off.
Jebus Barb you're boring. At least tell us about the anal sex you have with that mean you married.
Barb, you didn't answer me @ #181
1) I am a heterosexual woman who happens to like anal sex on occasion. Is this still wrong in your eyes?
2) Does the bible actually say anything about lesbian relationships?
Mainly what it is is a chronology