AAI Convention

Spectacularly OT:

Please take a look at this article detailing a missing child -- it's the son of a good friend. Any help is appreciated!

http://www.salisburypost.com/Area/081508-missing-child

Yes! Finally a So Cal atheist conference! Can't wait I will be there for sure.

Mostly a lurker here, but I live in Long Beach. I'm willing to coordinate a Pharyngulite party if no one else is working on one already. The e-mail address works if people want to start sending RSVPs.

The Secular Student Alliance has $100 and $200 travel grants available to help with airfare and so forth: http://www.secularstudents.org/node/2158

I bet the surprise awardee for the 2008 Richard Dawkins Award is Ben Stein, for tireless service in exposing the ID crowd for the raving nutters that they are.

Betz:

Shhhhhh...

OT Sastra, would you be so kind? I would like the full text of your address to the Unitarian Universalists. Thanks

My ship is docked in Washington, DC. I want you to speak at American University PZ.

Excellent! I'm in Los Angeles this month. I will now be able to partake of the Pharyngafestivities. Plus how could I pass up a chance to heckle PZ?

About Francis' offer to organize: I don't see the email link.

Poll on "in God we trust" on money at
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10103521/

Francis, where were you thinking about as a location for the Pharyngulite party? The Auld Dubliner Irish Pub might be a good location, it is pretty close to the Queen Mary on Pine St.

Ooh, excellent. I had no idea this was happening, but I live in LA. I'll have to get down to Long Beach!

ah, oops. I thought that putting in my e-mail addy when I wrote the comment would create a link. try flogan at charter.net.

Auld Dubliner is pretty small; I was thinking the Rock Bottom at the corner of Pine and Broadway. (link here.)

There are a number of nice places on the QM herself, but they can be pretty pricey. Also, if people are coming from out of town, they're more likely to stay at one of the hotels along Broadway.

That looks pretty good to me; I will defer to people who actually know Long Beach, since I'm up in Culver City.

Any meetups in picturesque places the second half of October? I need an out-of-town vacation; I was given plane tickets as comp for getting bumped from a flight early this year...

Ahhh your right, that would be a better choice. There is a really cool lounge in the Queen Mary, but drinks are like $12 a pop and you have to deal with an annoying Neil Diamond impersonator in sequins. On second thought, maybe that would be the perfect location haha

I want to see PZ on the bow of the Queen Mary shouting "I'm king of the reality based world!!!" just before an angry God rams an iceberg into it and smites all those militant atheists.

But please... no singing by Celine Dion.

If you are flying in, batter buy tickets as soon as possible the rates are going up, but it's still cheaper than driving (from TX anyway).

For all those who know the area, I used to perform in a band at Panama Joe's on Belmont Shore.

As much as I love the art deco bar at the front of QM, I agree it can be pricey. The Rock Bottom sounds good to me but those saying on the QM will have probably have to take taxis which are neither cheap nor convenient.

FYI Jet Blue flies directly into Long Beach airport for pretty cheap. Alot better than dealing with LAX.

hmm, this sounds like fun, I may have to try and go

While taxis are cheaper, LB has a very nice local bus system called Passport. Main link is here; route map here. If you're ultra-cool you can take the Aquabus and get to downtown LB from the QM across the harbor (not that I've ever tried).

There are a number of hotels along Bway, so if the QM is out of your price range, keep looking. Also, as a prior commenter noted, Jet Blue flies into LB airport, which is much closer and less aggravating than LAX.

I am excited about the possibility of meetup that I can attend!

I wish I had the financial wherewithal to attend the convention, but I don't. I can probably do one evening in Long Beach, though!

Bob Williams #7:
Sure. Send PZ your email and I'll forward it on to you.

Wahhhh wah wah no one ever comes to Pittsburgh wah.

Waahhhhhhhh!!!

Yeah, right. Militant atheist. Let's all go and heckle him.

That was the first big laugh I had today. Thanks.

I sure would like to hear a PZ speech, but he never comes to south Florida where I live.

Sastra, since this seems to be the OT thread of the moment, I'll add that Greg Laden posted a statement from Webster Cook's friend Benjamin Collard yesterday. I don't know whether Collard is still hanging around, but he was answering questions yesterday.

http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2008/08/benjamin_collard_speaks_out_o…

I don't know that many Pharyngulites saw it, but I figured they might be interested.

off topic: The poll that asks should the Magic Man's name be on USA money. (see #10).

319,199 responses. 51% voted in favor of respecting the Establishment Clause in the Bill of Rights. 49% voted for throwing out the Bill of Rights so we can have a Christian theocracy.

320k responses? Damn, we can't rend that poll to irrelevance quite as easily as one run by the West Hobunk Gazette.

Forget legal principles, I never understood the point of it even in literal terms. What is it we trust in god to do? Make the sun rise? Make the rain fall? Well no, nobody's bought into that nonsense for quite a while. Do we trust him to run the economy? What's the Treasury Department, SEC, and the Fed for, then? Defend the country, keep us safe in our homes? Why would we need police or a military if the frickin' creator of the universe is on our side? Keep the skies clear and the water clean and the forests pure? That's the EPA's job. What, exactly, are they trusting this guy to do? Everything believers attribute to him seems to be carried out, from inception to completion, by us mere mortals.

If drink prices force you to sneak in a small flask, get an all-plastic model because security is very tight.

And don't stick it down your Doc Martins because you'll have to take those off , too.

Hi, a meet-up sounds great.
I live in Pasadena and rather than commuting and missing out on the drinks I'd like to stay somewhere in Long Beach for the AAI weekend. Maybe some of the locals can recommend an ok-ish and not too pricey option.
Cheers,
Axel

Forget legal principles, I never understood the point of it even in literal terms. What is it we trust in god to do?

You're missing the last half of the sentence: "In god we trust, others pay cash."

In addition to PZ, Michael Newdow (the plaintiff in the suit against "under God" in the pledge) and Jeremy Hall (the plaintiff in the suit against atheist discrimination in the army) will be there, along with other luminaries such as Michael Shermer, Julia Sweeney, and a special surprise awardee for the 2008 Richard Dawkins Award.

Steer clear of Michael Shermer's PowerPoint slides. Their wrongitude is proverbial.

FREEP THIS POLL!

Should the motto "In God We Trust" be removed from U.S. currency?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10103521/

Currently 51% yes.

I still don't understand why "PharynGALA" didn't take off.

But yes, let's all of us militants gather to show off our fatigues and compare weaponry.

Do you realize that FSM, or Flying Spaghetti Monster, can be rearranged into SFM, or spittle-flecked minion?

Coincidence?

I think not!

Our chief weapon is surprise...surprise and fear...fear and surprise.... Our two weapons are fear and surprise...and ruthless efficiency.... Our *three* weapons are fear, surprise, and ruthless efficiency...and an almost fanatical devotion to the Pope.... Our *four*...no... *Amongst* our weapons.... Amongst our weaponry...are such elements as fear, surprise....

[Thanks to MontyP]

Atheism is a natural consequence of the scientific way of looking at the world;

That's very flattering, but completely ridiculous. You have absolutely no way of knowing if there is correlation, let alone causation.
And unfortunately, societal conditions have made atheism just as likely a subject for prevarication as belief in God is.

Whether someone "believes in God" is only testable by their own profession, and anyone who would say that ("I believe in God") is an accomplished liar (Think about it. They are attesting to something which can, at best be known by inference, but...) But it may go the other way, too.

My strictly un-scientific she-male intuition tells me that in any given church, about half the congegration is lying about their belief, but at an atheist convention, only about a quarter of the attendees secretly believe in God.

But we'll never know.

"the scientific perspective is ascendant."

Well, PZ has to go a little easy on that one. Several years ago Physics was pretty sure the world was eternal. Now they are pretty sure its 15 to 16 billion years old and there indicators that they are ready to go back to the eternal. That seems more like back and forth than "ascendant".

That seems more like back and forth than "ascendant".

Umm, that would be this thing called 'science'. Y'see we look at evidence and see what sense can be made off it. If we then find evidence that convincingly changes the picture then we have to change how we explain things to account for that. If we learn something new that makes Last Tuesdayism a better account of the universe than the current big-bang (sorta-concensus) then so be it.

Only religions (and their cousins, political beliefs) argue that they know the Truth and It Cannot Change. And frankly, their arguments suck. But not in a good way.

Only religions (and their cousins, political beliefs) argue that they know the Truth and It Cannot Change. And frankly, their arguments suck. But not in a good way.

Actually, religions change quite a bit. The problem is, not once do they ever say "we might be wrong". It was The Truth. Then it changed. Then it was still The Truth and so is what they changed it from.

Science builds a house by continually trying to knock it down. When it falls, the pieces are examined and the next house is built stronger.

Religion builds a house by sheltering it from the wind and anything that might damage it and, when it does happen to fall, builds it again the same way with the same materials, and says it's the same house.

Re Francis @ 22:

I think you mean the bus is cheaper, as the C-line is free.

I am kind of interested to see how this will go over, considering how conservitive* Long Beach tends to be. *Judging from the large numbers of 'theist' conventions LB plays host to and the number of sign-wavers generally present on the LB campus at the beginning of the semester.

Atheism is a natural consequence of the scientific way of looking at the world;

That's very flattering, but completely ridiculous. You have absolutely no way of knowing if there is correlation, let alone causation.

Well my atheism is a direct consequence of the scientific way of looking at the world. YMMV of course.

O/T, but this is scary:

Court rules it's OK for jurors to consult torture manual Bible during deliberations

Well my atheism is a direct consequence of the scientific way of looking at the world. YMMV of course.

I was born that way. Made for painful childhood scenes, of course, but I never wavered.

When I got older, I got a few drinks under my belt, and took on a related cargo of chemicals, and went to three different places of worship, one Catholic, one Protestant, and my own schul. At each I cursed G-d, and challenged him, in effect, to do a G-ddammed thing to me. As I expected, the coward didn't show, and no sneak attack has come either. Even if G-d does exist, a few threats will send Him scurrying.

Now that I think about it, if you derive your atheism from science, you have my sympathy. Mine atheism is a matter of profound and inborn faith. When your science is in tatters and being re-assembled in a different shape, as it has been so many times, my atheism will still be strong and vibrant. You have concluded G-d doesn't exist. I know (as much as we poor humans can know anything) He doesn't, and know He is a poopyhead into the bargain!

Hear that G-d? You're a poopyhead! And your kid's a nutty mess, without sense enough to leave town.

After all, didn't science accept G-ds existence for hundreds of years? Why couldn't it do so again?

I would rather know the truth of G-d's non-existence for myself, than have some scientist tell me to be atheist.

In case I have shocked anybody, I want to make it very clear that when financial gain or the possibility of sex enters into it, I can feign belief in God as well or better than any so-called "believer". So don't worry, everything is fine!

And I love, love love Gospel and other religious music, always have. I get a double pleasure from it that "believers" will never know. Hallelujah!

Science, feh! Why can't I be an atheist, just cause I like being one? Whatsamatter guys, science "forcing" you to the conclusion of atheism? That's chicken shit. Why not be an atheist just for the hell of it? Just cause you wanna?

Besides, don't you feel sort of guilty? You don't have to kill G-d with science to be an atheist. I don't think He's worth the effort, frankly, and it's degrading to science to be used for that purpose. Why should science descend to the level of religion?

As an update, for anyone who paid attention to my post at the top:

An anonymous tip led the police to the mother today. She'd been all over the southeast, but the dad is in possession of his son again, and the mother is in custody. Please update anyone you passed this along to. I'd hate to see this turn into an urban legend "forward this email" thing.

Hey, I live in LA, thanks for the heads up. I might just attend.

My ship is Newcastle, Australia.
It'd be great if PZ could come down under!
Or even Richard Dawkins!?! =P

Do you remember last May when president Bush called for a National Day of Prayer.While Christians were on their knees begging to the air,Atheists across the country were donating blood,the gift of life.
At the AAI Convention,on Friday,September 26th from 10:00 a.m.thru 4:00 p.m.we're have a blood donation aboard the Queen Mary in the Board Room(Promenade Deck,Midship).Blood collected by HemaCare will be donated to Long Beach Memorial Hospital.
Knee pads not necessary.

Atheism is a natural consequence of the scientific way of looking at the world; furthermore, the scientific perspective is ascendant.

Hmmm. I've no problem with people believing this (free country, yada yada), but if you do believe the scientific way of looking at the world leads naturally to atheism then you have no cause to complain about creationists saying evolution is atheism in scientific garb, or about the very existence of creationism in the first place.