So Amanda and I arrive at some public building in a largish Midwestern city. I'm a scientist, here to sit on a panel for a public discussion related to science and education. The building, a library, is not open yet but is scheduled to open in a few minutes. There are two groups of people standing in the flurries and chilly wind waiting for opening. The larger group is pressed against the door, seemingly anxious, and I (incorrectly, it turns out) attribute this anxiety to the cold. I'm thinking they want to go inside because it is cold. All but two people in this group are brown to dark brown of complexion, mostly African American and two or three Native Americans, and probably some people I'd be uncomfortable guessing the ethnicity of. The other group was smaller, older, and very much whiter, standing away from the door off some distance from the others. I recognized one of these individuals as a person who goes to these sorts of events. So naturally, Amanda and I wandered over to that group figuring they would know something like where the panel discussion was to be, and so on.
But in a very short time, we realize that no one in either group was really socializing. That was the effect of the cold, I think. People were just standing around and waiting. In two distinct groups. Just then, Amanda and I must have had the same thought at exactly the same second (not uncommon for us). We looked at each other, and Amanda mouthed the words "Cafeteria."
"Cafeteria" is a buzzword for an effect we see in many settings, but most notably in High Schools, where the HS students sort themselves out using the prevailing ethnic categories. (It comes from the book "Why Are All The Black Kids Sitting Together in the Cafeteria?": A Psychologist Explains the Development of Racial Identity
So of course we wandered over to the brown enclave and insinuated our white asses into the ethnic otherness.
Eventually, exactly on time in fact, the doors opened, and the "Fifty Brown People and Four White Ones" streamed into the library. There we found a police guard and a stern Librarian. The stern librarian announced "For Internet Access: Adults in this line," ... pointing over there ... "and children under 18 in that line" ... pointing somewhere else. And everybody excepting Amanda and me and a couple of other people formed two lines, rather long lines, to get access to the internet.
So, that was the reason for the apparent pressed-against-the-door effect. It was kinda like a proto-line.
On the internet, nobody can tell you're a black kid from the hood who lives in a house that has never had a computer.
So eventually, Greg Laden, PhD finds the room where the sciency presentation thing is supposed to happen. The other members of the discussion panel ... two other white doods with PhD's and two white chicks with PhD's ... show up, and about a hundred participants. It is an almost pure white crowd, including a couple of whitish Asian people. There was not a single darkly complected person in the room. I sat in the front of the room, facing the audience, and thus also facing the glass wall in the back which flanked the entrance hall of the library, and I watched over the next hour as dozens of people came in and out of the building. Almost none were white. Several younger kids (14 to 16 years old, roughly) stopped to stare into the room at all the white people.
How often does a white science-education type person like me get to experience such a stark contrast in various aspects of life where one of the key variables is skin color? Well, all the time, actually. But some instances and events are more interesting than others. This day at the library was illustrative, mainly, of the fact that neighborhoods in this region of the country tend to be segregated, and mainly white pan-suburban groups such as the one for which this science and education panel was convened happened to choose this library in which to meet for some reason. (I asked them ... "Is this your usual meeting place" and the answer was "no, we move around a lot.)
Back a few years, I saw the Cafeteria Effect happen in a very different way, and in this case, probably a very positive way. A remembrance of that might be a helpful touchstone in discussing the issue of diversity in science.
I was teaching a tutorial in Biological Anthropology at Harvard. Relatively speaking, all Harvard Students are privileged, if for no other reason than that they are at Harvard and are now somehow privileged even if they were not so much as they grew up. But the truth is that Harvard's admission policies are probably not as nefarious in this way as people might assume. What I'm getting at is this: There is diversity and there is diversity. Having a lot of black faces mixed in with white and Asian faces, and so on, is nice for role model effects, but if all those black faces happen to be the wealthy and well educated offspring of Nigerian Kings, well, the kids from the hood at our library (see above) can tell this. So the role model effect is weakened. So would the mentoring effect be as well. The positive effects of this sort of diversity do not go away when the people in the role models really do not have the same lived experience as the kids or young adults being modeled for, but I'm thinking it the effects are reduced.
Having said that, if you gather together into one place a dozen or so very dark skinned Harvard students, you will find a Nigerian Prince/Princess or two, but you will also find plain old American Citizens who's parents perhaps are middle or working class. This will not be the same group of people who are at the library (see above) but the true diversity of the Harvard group will not be a total sham either. Just a partial sham.
Anyway, I was teaching this tutorial and a couple of other classes, and one of my shticks is the biology of race. I have this thing about race. I don't think, based on pretty good evidence, that it exists as a valid biological construct for our species, and I find many of the efforts to prove or insist (or just stamp the feet up and down and bloody scream) that it does are linked to an agenda of social, political, educational, or economic inequality. And I was teaching and talking about these ideas back then, and in fact, was the only person doing that forcefully at the time in the Bioanthro department. (Not that I was alone in my viewpoint. Not at all. I was just taking on the job of being the one with this particular pedagogical product to offer our constituents.)
One day an African American student in our department (the? African American student in our department) showed up in my office with an interesting but not entirely rare situation. She had never taken the "Sophomore Tutorial" (required of all sophomores) and was about to graduate (with highest honors). The reasons are unimportant. These things usually happen when a student takes up some opportunity or another for research or learning abroad and the student's schedule gets all screwed up.
This student had to take the tutorial in the upcoming semester, but wanted to take the tutorial from me specifically. Why? Because she liked my stuff on race and racism, and had a few friends in her "house" (a house = a dorm at Harvard) who would also like this stuff. In fact, she offered to arrange to have the tutorial taught at the house rather than in a classroom somewhere. This was always good. The houses had nice seminar rooms, and if you could teach a tutorial in a house, the students in that tutorial would usually be house-mates, could form a study group on the topic, and maybe they would give you food now and then.
I totally agreed that this would be a good idea and it came to pass that I taught the tutorial at that house.
Now a quick word about Harvard Houses. In the old days (well, not the really old days ... let's just say over the last century and a half) the houses had become affiliated with one or another characteristic. By the time I was teaching there, there was a gay house, there was a geek house, there was an anthro house, and so on. This did not mean that everyone in the house was gay or a geek or whatever. This was just a trend. Harvard at that time was trying to undo this compartmentalization but their efforts had not yet taken effect. And, one of the houses was still the "African American" house. My student's house was this house, and her friends who would find my race and racism shtick interesting were all black. One was a Nigerian princess, even.
Nothing else happened. The tutorial was spectacular. The kids were brilliant. The number of dark skinned students in the department went from one or two up to about six or seven because of this tutorial. Then I did it again. And again. A few times. Same house, same effect. African American kids and the occasional Nigerian Prince/Princess (or whomever) who were all destine for either medical school or public health ended up majoring in Bioanthro rather than ... whatever. Anthropology at Harvard went from being 99% white to being 92% white simply because one student thought it could happen, and tricked me into facilitating it.
Well, OK, she did not trick me. She brought me into her plans from the beginning. But I shall not reveal the secret nature of our conversations even if tortured. Or tutored.
I don't know what happened a couple of years later when I left Harvard. The other people teaching the tutorial were also doing the race/racism thing as well, but not as extensively as me (they had other favorite topics). The near lack of non-whitosity on the faculty ensured the absence of any real role models. But at least at this point I know there are a dozen non-white MD's, public health officials, whatever, who would have had those same careers anyway, but did it through a bioanthro route instead of a bio route or some other pre-med route.
And in part because of the Cafeteria effect. This time, working in a positive way.
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Well ... I think there is a role model from Harvard in the white house right now!
Well, while this was all happening Barack was within a few hundred meters the whole time being in law school. More or less.
I've seen pretty much exactly the same "cafeteria effect" at various public venues, e.g. author book signings or public science lectures of various kinds. The audience(at least in my area), tends to be "mostly" white and some Asians. Very few blacks, usually no Native Americans at all. This was true even when I went with some friends, to hear the author Sherman Alexie speak(he's Native American, and very, very funny, BTW). I find this kind of sad. It's not that the black people I know don't read; many of them do. And it's not that they aren't interested in sciency things. They are. It's just that they don't go to them. They're not used to it, or they don't feel welcome, or something. So they stick to their "own" events -- to their own cultural impoverishment, and, for that matter, the cultural impoverishment of other groups, because the other groups don't "cross over", either.
Anne G
For someone who insists "race doesn't exist," you exhibit a remarkable aptitude for making racial distinctions.
Godlesss: Indeed, yes!!! I seem that way but I'm always bad at it. When any attempt to verify my racial presumption comes along, I'm often wrong, and I've got a PhD in this. Why would that be???
At what point is it reasonable to "Cafeteria up"? Should one always give up self-interest in banding with similar peoples so that the Cafeteria is well-mixed? Who should make the first move you or the other groups in the Cafeteria? What if the other groups are hostile? What if resources are dwindling (what if the Cafeteria is running out of food)? What if the economy melts down to the point of no return? Would you seek allies within your Cafeteria group...or continue to experiment with mixing groups while your family members starve?
If "race doesn't exist" what is puzzling is how people manage to produce the "cafeteria effect".
Could you state your arguments for your opinion at a current GNXP thread?
Or may be you don't bother to argue with GNXPers no more than they would bother to comment here?
Swish, they've made great strides in modern treatment of anxiety. I'm pretty sure someone can help you now.
Kevembuangga, that's all you've got? How do the geeks and jocks, rich and poor kids produce a cafeteria effect if the group distinctions aren't genetic?
Stephanie, humans have made great strides in reason and logic since the dark ages. I am sure that a philosophy professor can help you as well.
At what point is it reasonable to "Cafeteria up"? Should one always give up self-interest in banding with similar peoples so that the Cafeteria is well-mixed? Who should make the first move you or the other groups in the Cafeteria? What if the other groups are hostile?
Good question, but the answer is astonishingly simple. It is simply not the case that everywhere in the world everyone pays the kind of attention we do in the US and large parts of Europe to the shading of skin. These kids in the cafeteria could be using other variables to divide themselves up and it would be the same (like social class, for instance ... and no, that is not more subtle). We as a society chose to use race as a designator, and this use is underscored and supported every time someone uses race as a designator. Even my use of it here in this post and here in these comments is part of that, unless the concept's use is embedded in an aggressively anti-racist or more exactly anti-race-based-thinking program.
The race designators and distinctions, as absurd as they are, are being used by these kids every day because they are trained up in our society to do this.
Kevembuangga I would be vaguely interested to know how much time and effort you spend every day telling other people what to do.
And what Stephanie, who obviously got up earlier in the morning than I did, said.
I agree with you that banding together based on skin tone or genetic features in general could possibly be arbitrary. However the question you didn't answer is ....is it ok to band together with others to protect one's self-interst? If so...do people have time to sort out complex variables such as intelligence, political affiliation, ideology etc...especially when they are hastily thrown together in a cafeteria?
No...I think they don't so they use the easiest designator of a potential ally....skin tone (and other physical features). So even if they proceed into being put together for long periods of time...they build close relationships based on that initial sorting. Thus the system is self-reinforcing.
I also don't agree with you when you say race doesn't exist. I would agree if we could agree to do away with the term race and use the term deme instead because I do believe there is little question that there are genetically distinct groups of humans.
Also, James Watson was hammered for his ideas about race...and I understand why he was because it is true there is no scientific evidence for what he said. But what everybody is not admitting is that at least some of what he said is possible (we may find out in the future). It could be that some demes of humans are more intelligent. It could be that some demes of humans are more athletic. You have to at least concede to that ...no?
Skin color is not the indicator being implied here.
The kids in the high school cafeteria are not hastily thrown together. Quite the opposite.
Well...we were hastily thrown together when I was in high school. And you could see the cafeteria effect and how it formed there.
The black kids and white kids spoke a different language almost. So culture drove us apart from the beginning. And yes this wasn't Harvard...resources were limited. Fights would break out over turf, lunch money, tennis shoes...you name it. And interestingly within the larger groups (black/white) there would be subgroups that would struggle with each other...geeks, jocks...like Stephanie mentioned.
I have a theory that discrimination is inevitable in Homo sapiens. Homo sapiens will always find a way to discriminate (based on a whole cadre of variables) no matter what. So do we crawl into a hole and let discrimination take its natural course against us ...or do we protect our self-interest and do some discriminating ourselves?
Its like prison. You find allies or get left in the dust.
Swish, if you haven't, I recommend reading up on The Prisoner's Dilemma. If you have, I recommend checking the winning strategy again.
So, Swish, did you get hastily thrown together every day in a new high school? Maybe you should define hastily.
Your assertion that this problem can't be fixed and therefore we should become part of the problem is a deeply fucked idea. Pardon my English.
We were thrown together ...no introductions...go at it kids...that is what I mean by hasty.
Stephanie...from what I remember resources levels aren't included as a variable in the prisoner's dilemma and that is central selfish ideals. Cooperating with everyone when there are little resources left is stupid.
...and that applies to your comment Mr. Laden. Yes the problem can be fixed....give us Homo sapiens an unlimited supply of resources....all is well.
Greg I would be vaguely interested to know how much time and effort you spend every day telling other people what to do.
A poor attempt at Stratagem VIII?
I am surprised you didn't use the standard racist epithet, is it already that worn out?
In any case "La, la, la, can't hear you" is an excellent strategy, a sure win, but we know which kind of people use that...
We were thrown together ...no introductions...go at it kids...that is what I mean by hasty.
But then what happened over the next, say, four years?
Swish: You are doing a very good job at supplying the other piece of the puzzle when we see "white pride" groups who claim to not be racist. And dangerous. Appreciate that.
Over the next four years...some maturing occured amongst the student. The cafeteria effect didn't disappear.
How do you know my deme? I am a member of a hispanic pride group.
Thanks for answering none of my questions.
Swish, that characterization of The Prisoner's Dilemma doesn't make much sense. I suggest looking at the research again.
Swish, why does being a member of "Hispanic pride" vs. "white pride" mean anything in this context? Who cares?
And SZ is right that you do not get P.D. At all.
". . . you will also find plain old American Citizens who's parents perhaps are middle or working class."
I think it is "whose" and not "who's." "Who's" is a contraction for who is, while "whose" is possessive. Just thought you might like to know that-hope I don't offend.
I noticed the Cafeteria Effect at an employer's cafeteria 20 years ago and have made a point to observe racial groupings over the years. My casual observations are that the racial divisions are lessoning fairly rapidly, mostly due to the aging of the racists than anything else, but still good news. Racially diverse groups are fairly common, especially in bars, where not 10 years ago (I'm in Texas) it would have been rare.
I've also found a consistent, glaring exception to the racial cafeteria effect, at least in the corporate world: the computer guys. It got to be a joke when I consulted to walk into the cafeteria of the larger clients, saunter up to the first racially mixed table and play psychic by asking them about their software. 9 times out of 10 I'd hit bewildered paydirt.
Interesting post, but I'm a bit confused. "Whitish Asian person?"
Samia: Thanks for asking. I am totally guilty of making more than the average number of veiled references that only a few people would understand through no fault of their own. One had to be in the room at the time to get my reference. Interestingly enough, I've been raked over at least one pile of luke warm coals for this reference. Which I ignored. But you are asking me to explain so I will be happy to!
Anyone in the room at the time, feel free to chime in and disagree or elaborate.
A number of questions were asked about human evolution in relation to the usual issues people tend to bring up, and the inevitable concern was raised that certain people (poor and dark skinned) are reproducing at a much higher rate than certain other people (well educated white people) and that this was going to ruin human evolution. In my experience in this sort of forum (which is vast, IIMSSM) this is a white male asking the question 85% of the time. This time it was an Asian female, for a change (I believe this person would self identify as East or Southeast Asian). Her ethnicity is not really important, but there was an irony given the nature of the Twin Cities, recent immigration, TC-specific racism issues, etc. etc. An irony tuned further by the exact neighborhood we were in (it's complicated).
(The average third generation Nordic Saint Paulite is rather concerned, or so they tell me, about the rabbit-like breeding habits of the most recent southeast Asian immigrant population.)